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Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 1:01 pm
by quietvoice
1. Any religion or teaching which denies the Natural Laws of the Universe is false.
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 2:47 pm
by quietvoice
Candid wrote: ↑Wed Aug 07, 2024 7:31 pm "humans are frugivores", which is patent nonsense;
Anatomy and Physiology points to it. You are born that way. You've been cultured away from what you are. We are suffering as a culture because we live, as a culture, against Nature.
quietvoice wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 1:01 pm
1. Any religion or teaching which denies the Natural Laws of the Universe is false.
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 5:53 pm
by Candid
quietvoice wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 2:47 pm
You are born that way.
You are mistaken; I was born a mammal. My first sustenance was MILK.
We are suffering as a culture because we live, as a culture, against Nature.
I am not. You probably are.
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 6:34 pm
by quietvoice
Candid wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 5:53 pm
quietvoice wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 2:47 pm
You are born that way.
You are mistaken; I was born a mammal. My first sustenance was MILK.
Yes, of course, your MOTHER'S milk, as Nature intended.
We are suffering as a culture because we live, as a culture, against Nature.
I am not. You probably are.
Sorry, if you are not living according to how Nature made you, by not noticing how your physiology operates for good or for ill (sickness), then you are living a lifestyle of degeneration. But choose to ignore it. It's not for me to worry about on your behalf.
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 7:07 pm
by quietvoice
Candid wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 5:53 pm
quietvoice wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 2:47 pm
You are born that way.
You are mistaken; I was born a mammal. My first sustenance was MILK.
Yes, of course, your MOTHER'S milk, as Nature intended.
By the way, Candid, the frugivorous species are mammalian species. So?
/
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 8:41 pm
by Fulgurator
quietvoice wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 12:31 pm
Neither of you have proven me wrong in any of my posts.
Y'all just criticize.
And yet, if you are of the White/European race, I am identifying our enemy. If you want to act exactly like the covid fools act/acted, in regards to our mortal enemy, then so be it. That makes you race traitors. Thanks a lot.
Barbara Lerner Spectre told us what was going to happen in Europe, and it is happening. But continue with your deafness-dumbness-blindness.
"Neither of you have proven me wrong in any of my posts.
Y'all just criticize."
That would be hard to do because you tend to copy and paste material that you select based on emotional preference. What you want to hear and accept as reality.
Plato taught there are three regions of the mind. Knowledge, anger and desire. In your case, knowledge is dictated to by both desire and anger. So, you are both angry and desire whatever reality or explanation quenches that anger. Hate can't exist without a target. In your case, your reasoning seeks to find a cause to rationalise the anger.
A healthy individual, Plato says, subjugates anger and desire to reason. So, logic alone governs thinking. It has to be free from the bias caused by anger, hate, desired reality.
"Indocilitas" is the factor here. Quiet Voice can assimilate information (sapientia) but can't process or manage information to create an accurate take on reality. So, we get strings of uncoordinated, selective snippets that satisy the desired reality. Here the desired reality is:
(1) I stand head and shoulders above the rest.
(2) All my unhappiness has a simple cause ("them")
(3) I can dissipate my anger by sharing with others who is to blame for the state of things around me. I can convince others that I alone have found proof of my theory.
So, paranoia and narcissism.
The cure?
Partly it exists. Recognise the anger. Learn to think logically by doing maths, philosophy and science. Develop the analytical over the base emotional instincts. Face up to reality and learn to perceive it outside of childish, simplistic patterns.
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 9:43 pm
by quietvoice
Fulgurator wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 8:41 pm
"Neither of you have proven me wrong in any of my posts.
Y'all just criticize."
That would be hard to do because you tend to copy and paste material that you select based on emotional preference. What you want to hear and accept as reality.
Plato taught there are three regions of the mind. Knowledge, anger and desire. In your case, knowledge is dictated to by both desire and anger. So, you are both angry and desire whatever reality or explanation quenches that anger. Hate can't exist without a target. In your case, your reasoning seeks to find a cause to rationalise the anger.
A healthy individual, Plato says, subjugates anger and desire to reason. So, logic alone governs thinking. It has to be free from the bias caused by anger, hate, desired reality.
"Indocilitas" is the factor here. Quiet Voice can assimilate information (sapientia) but can't process or manage information to create an accurate take on reality. So, we get strings of uncoordinated, selective snippets that satisy the desired reality. Here the desired reality is:
(1) I stand head and shoulders above the rest.
(2) All my unhappiness has a simple cause ("them")
(3) I can dissipate my anger by sharing with others who is to blame for the state of things around me. I can convince others that I alone have found proof of my theory.
So, paranoia and narcissism.
The cure?
Partly it exists. Recognise the anger. Learn to think logically by doing maths, philosophy and science. Develop the analytical over the base emotional instincts. Face up to reality and learn to perceive it outside of childish, simplistic patterns.
Eh, blah, blah, blah.
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Thu Aug 08, 2024 9:49 pm
by Fulgurator
For Candid:
"Heard of Zoroastrianism? The ancient religion still has fervent followers
Once the faith of millions, a small but devoted number of adherents in Asia and North America keep the flame of faith burning.
But in the past century, the faith has traveled far from its origins—to places like Los Angeles, Mexico City, and Stockholm—and inspired new, progressive communities where anyone who follows the tenets of the ancient prophet Zarathushtra can be considered a Zoroastrian.
In much of the world’s imagination, Zoroastrianism conjures up something ancient, and maybe a bit exotic. But the basic tenets are fundamental to people everywhere: good versus evil, resurrection, and the afterlife. At its core is humata, hukhta, hvarshta: “good thoughts, good words, good deeds.”
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Fri Aug 09, 2024 3:59 am
by Fulgurator
Effective thinking is very hard to do. I myself struggle to think clearly, free from bias, anger, or desired reality. However, not being neurotypical, my thinking developed over time to better bypass emotions.
A huge number of people are slaves to their emotions or the influence of those they automatically follow.
Quiet Voice makes the following mistakes in her thinking:
She's angry and emotionally charged but her rational brain tries to sketch out a reason or cause for that anger. Worryingly, like Adolf Hitler she is filled with rage over the Jewish race. This may be connected to some event in the past. Hitler had serious mental health pathologies and rages. Pathological anger can be serious. Elliot Roger, for example, suffered from rage over perceived female rejection.
The other issue is when anger becomes so dominant it totally dominates reason. So, the person affected will ignore information that challenges the chosen conclusion and regurgitate selected "proofs". Take Mark David Chapman. His target for pathological hatred wasn't a particular race but John Lennon. He was enraged by Lennon supposedly being a fraud or hypocrite. This hatred absorbed his mind. Elliot Roger was absorbed by the rage he felt against women. When that happens, there is loss of reality and distorted perception. I know all of this through talking to many people affected by psychosis, or psychopathology. Plus my own huge struggles.
First step is to acknowledge the problem. View yourself objetively. I admitted I had anger issues and issues I needed to acknowledge. Quiet Voice hasn't yet taken that initial step. It's not easy.
Re: Plato And Psychology
Posted: Fri Aug 09, 2024 8:29 am
by Candid
Fulgurator wrote: ↑Thu Aug 08, 2024 9:49 pm
... the basic tenets are fundamental to people everywhere: good versus evil, resurrection, and the afterlife. At its core is humata, hukhta, hvarshta: “good thoughts, good words, good deeds.”
My personal jury's out on the question of resurrection and an afterlife and I have regular struggles with the "good thoughts" bit, but otherwise I'm okay with me.
Doing good
feels good, and the reverse is true.
An afterlife may or may not be wishful thinking. I can't possibly know. Well, not yet, anyway.